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Thread: DAWSUM Project-Part II

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  1. #1
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    DAWSUM Project-Part II

    quote:
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by Chris R Gibson:
    So let's nail this down and/or get on with the "GREAT ANALOG EMULATION PLUG IN SHOOT OUT EXTRAVAGANZAORAMA!"
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Good news. I have discussed the next shootout, preliminarily dubbed the "Awesome Analog Soundalike Sampler," with the highly-respected maker of a much anticipated plug-in and he has agreed to let me try a prerelease version to demo what it is capable of doing. Good news indeed. I may also include some hardware options, even hopefully one that originated as a result of the DAWSUM CD. I'll keep you posted. It will be a while though, since work has taken off again.

    I may ask some of you for assistance on this project as well since it goes a lot faster when I don't have to do everything myself. And there may be platforms needed that I don't have. Like HD or anything on a PC (Magneto and others). So if you have options that should be included and are willing to help out, let me know. You can just list them here.
    Lynn Fuston
    3D Audio

    Making beautiful music SEEM easy since 1979.

  2. #2
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    My guess is I have one of the more typical set ups, with a couple of the basic emulators. After all I have taken from this site, the least I can do is offer any possible assistance.

    PT 24+/OS 9
    MacDSP AC1/AC2
    DAD Valve/Tape TDM (the Charles Dye chain!)

    Don't know is this is a consideration but I do occasionally fake some analog like sound out of my Bomb Factory Sans Amp and Line 6 Amp Farm (using cabinet simulations with minimal distortion settings) though that is a little bit of a stretch methinks. May be getting a PSP Vintage Warmer for Logic/OSX, waiting for AU version for laptop system. And finally I run Logic 6.1 ESB/TDM and OSX Audio Core if any manufacturer needs to beta test any Mac format (VST/AU/RTAS/TDM)!!! I also could involve a friend for SPL Charisma hardware.

    BTW, hearing great things about your recent conference, congratulations, wish I could have made it.
    Chris R. Gibson AKA Loopy C
    www.micworks.com
    Ken Tamplin Mastering

  3. #3
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    Originally posted by Chris R Gibson:
    <STRONG>BTW, hearing great things about your recent conference, congratulations, wish I could have made it.</STRONG>
    It was a blessing to be able to go and share. And sitting around the table and swapping stories and info with that level of talent is an incredible opportunity. I would encourage everyone to take advantage of that opportunity next year. New Orleans. What's not to like?
    Lynn Fuston
    3D Audio

    Making beautiful music SEEM easy since 1979.

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by 3D Audio Inc.:
    <STRONG>quote:

    I have discussed the next shootout, preliminarily dubbed the "Awesome Analog Soundalike Sampler," with the highly-respected maker of a much anticipated plug-,... </STRONG>

    Is it really an issue? Kind of a yawn for me. Realistically, it's a silly thing to get excited about. I'm a little offended that companies are selling out the quality names of old analog gear, but that is a personal thing. A new Mustang ain't a Shelby or Cobra, either, no matter what name you put on it.

    And a software digital compressor/reverb/eq/whatever should be able to stand on it's own merits, not have to be tied by name to a 35 year old analog piece long out of production, just to drive sales. If the software sounds good it sounds good, and if it doesn't it doesn't.

    Saying that the new Terbo Crumpus software plug of their 1964 Crumpus Maximus compressor sounds EXACTLY like your 1965 analog model Crumpus Maximus and reacts the same in all situations is not only doubtful, but doesn't say that MY 1965 Crumpus Maximus sounds like YOURS... since Crumpus had several modifications and parts changes, and different parts suppliers over original the market life of the units, and analog parts age over time, many units have been modified over time, and each one sounds a little different due to the natural effects of ageing and time.

    I've had a couple of 1176s and an 1178, and they each sounded a little different from each other. I've had quite a few old pieces.... nothing like Fairchilds or Pultechs, but some nice old vintage gear, and nothing analog matches over time unless the pieces were maintained in the same environment, used about the same, and kept in spec by the same guy or guys using the same methodology. Even then, it is a crapshoot.

    When I reviewed the Korby mic with the "vintage" capsules I made the point that I was unlikely to ever have a 251 from which to compare the sound of the Korby 251 emulation. That turned out to be untrue... the folks at Conway were kind enough to provide a 251 for comparison. But in the real world it doesn't matter... the Korby 251 capsule sounds wonderful, and my couple of hours of fooling around with a real 251 does not make me an expert on the mic. I barely had time to scratch the surface of what it sounds like, let alone learn the nuances that make it the desirable piece that it is. Far from enough time to more than a perfunctory comparison to the emulation.

    The only thing that really gets me excited about these various software emulators is when they are tied to a proprietary PCI card. I'm not at all excited about that type of technology. Less money spent on a bigger, faster processors allow you to run more of any plug from any manufacturer. But in the long run, if the stuff sounds good to you, it is what you should use, in whatever form it is packaged.

    Shame about the name thing though.


    Bill

  5. #5
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    Originally posted by Bill Park:
    <STRONG>Is it really an issue? Kind of a yawn for me. Realistically, it's a silly thing to get excited about. I'm a little offended that companies are selling out the quality names of old analog gear, but that is a personal thing. A new Mustang ain't a Shelby or Cobra, either, no matter what name you put on it. </STRONG>
    Well, Bill, did you see me there chatting with Bill Putnam over lunch? Because I did. But it had nothing to do with plugins. We were talking about "other stuff."

    No, though your points are well made, you pegged the wrong manufacturer. I was talking about the long anticipated (at least by me) Phoenix from Cranesong.
    Lynn Fuston
    3D Audio

    Making beautiful music SEEM easy since 1979.

  6. #6
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    Lunch with Bill P.? Wish that I could have been there.

    Bill (er....) P.

  7. #7
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    Perhaps I am misunderstanding, isn't this next shootout focusing on valve/tape emulators? In other words devices that emulate specifically the harmonic distortion and behavior of valves and the unique compression/bias curves of tape(I believe Lynn used the term "buss sweeteners"). I saw mentioned in Mr. Parks post 1176's and other "vintage-type" plug-ins. Perhaps Mr. Parks was making a more general statement of opinion, I just wanted to make sure we were all talking about the same thing. I figured it was the Phoenix being alluded to by Lynn so also assumed the specific catagory (as was original defined by Lynn in the "Analog Emulations-How close are they? thread). Still stand by the opinion it would be useful (and fun) information for any "in the box" mixers. I currently put my AC1 and DAD Valve/Tape plug-ins to great use and am very interested in Cranesong's entry into the field. I think it goes along with some of the discussion of current standards in the quality of "trades" reviews and this forum as an alternative for interested engineers with no hidden agendas and interest in specific products we might find ourselves using in our work.
    Chris R. Gibson AKA Loopy C
    www.micworks.com
    Ken Tamplin Mastering

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by Chris R Gibson:
    <STRONG>Perhaps I am misunderstanding, isn't this next shootout focusing on valve/tape emulators? In other words devices that emulate specifically the harmonic distortion and behavior of valves and the unique compression/bias curves of tape(I believe Lynn used the term "buss sweeteners"). I saw mentioned in Mr. Parks post 1176's and other "vintage-type" plug-ins. Perhaps Mr. Parks was making a more general statement of opinion, I just wanted to make sure we were all talking about the same thing. I figured it was the Phoenix being alluded to by Lynn so also assumed the specific catagory (as was original defined by Lynn in the "Analog Emulations-How close are they? thread). Still stand by the opinion it would be useful (and fun) information for any "in the box" mixers. I currently put my AC1 and DAD Valve/Tape plug-ins to great use and am very interested in Cranesong's entry into the field. I think it goes along with some of the discussion of current standards in the quality of "trades" reviews and this forum as an alternative for interested engineers with no hidden agendas and interest in specific products we might find ourselves using in our work.</STRONG>
    Analog mixing soundalikes. That's the category. Not specifically tube emulation, but anything that promises to get us closer to that "analog sound."

    Since we now have a control group to measure against (true analog mixes), we can try all the analog emulators and see how close they can come to the real analog mixes while using a digitally-summed mix.
    Lynn Fuston
    3D Audio

    Making beautiful music SEEM easy since 1979.

  9. #9
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    I own a UAD-1 from UniversalAudio/Mackie
    and a TC Powercore, as you might know
    both of them got several analog emulation
    plugins...
    If I can be of any help lemme know

  10. #10
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    [QUOTE]Originally posted by 3D Audio Inc.:
    [QB]

    Analog mixing soundalikes. That's the category. Not specifically tube emulation, but anything that promises to get us closer to that "analog sound."

    Gotcha!
    Chris R. Gibson AKA Loopy C
    www.micworks.com
    Ken Tamplin Mastering

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